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Space Forum / Shuttle / October 2005It's just wierd
With Bush and Griffin still hard set on dumping the shuttle in August 2010 no matter what, it just seems odd that testing and improvements continue to move ahead for something that's supposed to be dead in less than five years. I'm really starting to wonder what's going to happen. My gut feeling is either the shuttle program is going to be extended to allow people to slow down and do things right and get the shuttle flying the way it should be, or we're going to see far less than 18 flights. In fact, I would not be completely surprised if the shuttle does not fly again. I still think we should forget this moon and Mars craziness and improve on what we have. > With Bush and Griffin still hard set on dumping the shuttle in August 2010 > no matter what, it just seems odd that testing and improvements continue [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > I still think we should forget this moon and Mars craziness and improve on > what we have. I'm not sure how much you follow this stuff, but there is very little long-term direction of the space program. Every administration knows the one that succeeds it will change things just to assert "control". So, every administration hedges it's bets by funding little projects like these--just in case. In this case, the engineers insie NASA believe it's unlikely Mr. Bush's goals for the CEV will be met, so they push for upgrades--just in case... Personally, I think it's wise to upgrade them until the CEV is actually operational (if there is such a thing!). > With Bush and Griffin still hard set on dumping the shuttle in August 2010 > no matter what, it just seems odd that testing and improvements continue to > move ahead for something that's supposed to be dead in less than five years. And these same fellows are conspiring, even as we speak, to turn off the broadcast TV signals in 2009, making all of our TVs (but moreso TVs owned by poor Democrats) inoperative just *before* they plan to shut down the shuttle program. A sinister plan indeed, because, since there will be no TV, we Americans will have no idea what these sinister fellows would really be doing with the shuttle and with their Moon/Mars program! ;) - Ed Kyle <And these same fellows are conspiring, even as we speak, to turn off the broadcast TV signals in 2009, making all of our TVs (but moreso TVs owned by poor Democrats) inoperative just *before* they plan to shut down the shuttle program. A sinister plan indeed, because, since there will be no TV, we Americans will have no idea what these sinister fellows would really be doing with the shuttle and with their Moon/Mars program! ;) - Ed Kyle > First if you get your TV from cable or satellite, as nearly 88% do it will NOT effect your sets on these at all. For those using a antenna only, will see their tv shut off, but converter boxes will be available for under 75 bucks for each tv. this is all about the government auctioning off the tv bandwidth for profit. call your legislators and complain! its a rip off. lots of folks have tvs not on cable or sat as second tvs, these will go dark, and even today many tvs that cant get the new system are being sold as brand new.... poorly planned, poorly implemented. rip off of the consumer > we're going to see far less than 18 flights. In fact, I would not be > completely surprised if the shuttle does not fly again. works for me > I still think we should forget this moon and Mars craziness and improve on > what we have. why is exploring the solar system crazy, but continuing to pump billions of dollars into a spacecraft that can only go around in circles, and a space station that doesn't do what it was supposed to do, not crazy?!?  SignatureTerrell Miller millerto@bellsouth.net "Suddenly, after nearly 30 years of scorn, Prog is cool again". -Entertainment Weekly Bush whitehouse already said if shuttle never flys again they wouldnt be unhappy. the shuttle program is on its way out fast, the foundation is crumbling just as fast as columbias wings on its finaly flight. shuttle shouldnt kill again > With Bush and Griffin still hard set on dumping the shuttle in August 2010 > no matter what, it just seems odd that testing and improvements continue to > move ahead for something that's supposed to be dead in less than five years. Why is that odd? The shuttle is (has always been) an experimental craft, who's purpose is much more "learning how to do certain things" than "transporting stuff". We had the "transporting stuff" thing figured out during apollo. But we'll never be finished with learning. > I'm really starting to wonder what's going to happen. My gut feeling is > either the shuttle program is going to be extended to allow people to slow > down and do things right and get the shuttle flying the way it should be "should" by whos assessment? Before the first bolt was placed on the shuttle, the design spec'ed a 98% reliability. One catastrophic failure every 50 flights. That's what the designers said they could achieve within the budget. That's what congress ordered. That's what they got. That's as it "should" be. You want somehting else? Go ahead and order it. It'll be even more expensive. > or > we're going to see far less than 18 flights. In fact, I would not be > completely surprised if the shuttle does not fly again. Given the the per-flight cost decreases drastically the more often you fly, I see no reason to go that route. The major part of the cost is the personell that you can't exactly hire at home-depot on an hourly basis. The first launch of the fiscal year costs a lot of money, the second is comparatively cheap, the third nearly free. > I still think we should forget this moon and Mars craziness and improve on > what we have. Depends on who you mean with "we". The shuttle is at the end of its mission -- a mission to explore the engineering-reality of a regular earth-to-orbit commute. If "we" want to continue flying shuttles, the "we" should definitely not include NASA. It is not NASA's job to do routine operations. It is NASA's job to push the envelope, to expand what is known and what can be done. NASA has definitely done this. If Boeing or Lockheed or whoever would like to buy the hardware and fly it from here on, I do not think anybody would complain. But why would they? Why not take the knowledge gained and build something faster/better/cheaper? Meanwhile NASA will continue to do the cutting-edge stuff. The stuff for which there might not be a current market. The stuff where we are guaranteed to learn something in the process. The stuff where you can't just look up the formula in the book and plug in the numbers -- because the book isn't written yet. I have no quarrels with that. Why do you? cordially Y.T. SignatureRemove YourClothes before you email me. I believe NASA predicted a MUCH HIGHER SAFER NUMBER, death rate wise for the shuttle from day one. its one thing to lose a vehicle, the bad is people losing ther lives. I think nasa should say heres what we want to do, and let private industry of all kinds offer proposals. NASA needs to move out of the day in day out stuff and go explore, with both robots and people in article 1130440996.513886.63690@g47g2000cwa.googlegroups.com, ytyourclothes@p.zapto.org at ytyourclothes@p.zapto.org wrote on 10/27/05 12:23 PM: >> With Bush and Griffin still hard set on dumping the shuttle in August 2010 no >> matter what, it just seems odd that testing and improvements continue to move [quoted text clipped - 50 lines] > > I have no quarrels with that. Why do you? Hear, hear to everything you said. George Evans > In fact, I would not be completely surprised if the shuttle does not fly > again. There's a lot of scuttlebutt at the Cape that we may have seen the last one. A lot of folks expect a big ax to fall early next year. <There's a lot of scuttlebutt at the Cape that we may have seen the last one. A lot of folks expect a big ax to fall early next year. > As you know I think thats good but hope and believe the employees will be well taken care of with good comp packages, and moves to other positions. the real shuttle in a shuttle center will be a wonderful tourist attraction. hopefully the contractor deleware north? could hire one time shuttle workers as real life guides. I once visited a bomb silo near tuscon, it was the real thing, maintained as a museum. The guides were one time controllers, that made it great and I want to return there again. So what is the "scuttlebutt" on the de-orbit of the space station? > There's a lot of scuttlebutt at the Cape that we may have seen the last > one. A lot of folks expect a big ax to fall early next year. Station wouldnt be so easy....its most likely end. right after a prgress flight a in orbit parts failure, forces crew to return to earth, leaving station unmanned. unmanned stations control is lost and the station becomes a hazard dropping parts all along its ground track as it deorbits. Causes mass panic on ground, a few dead from debris, more dead from hysteria:( NEW safety board in created, and trashes nasa management for no fast parts to orbit capability. congress, president, and the american public tired of screw ups take man out of nasa and downsize it dramatically, leaving just a small robotic program....... you dont believe this is possible:( NASA has fought to keep the statrion manned permanetely because of this risk.. > So what is the "scuttlebutt" on the de-orbit of the space station? Not hearing anything about that. If they are retiring the shuttles, the station won't be too far behind. >> So what is the "scuttlebutt" on the de-orbit of the space station? > > Not hearing anything about that. I think ISS may survive on its own. The international partners could take over. question? if another accident grounded the shuttle forever. would that mean ISS is a goner too? > If they are retiring the shuttles, the station won't be too far behind. Or even first. president already said they wouldnt mind if shuttle never flew again.... look trim too many flights, like just 8 more they might as well ground it completely |
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