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Supermassive black hole experiment

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Willie.Mookie@gmail.com - 26 Aug 2008 03:30 GMT
The 4 million solar mass - supermassive black hole at the center of
our galaxy, spins at 37% the speed of light, and is 30,000 light years
away.

It is possible to send signals around that object in a way that
returns a portion of the signal back to Earth at a points in time
earlier as well as later than it left.  That is some of the radiant
energy arriving at the black hole forms a CTL path implementing a
reversed time link with nothing more than a radio telescope.   With
such a setup it should be possible to send signals back and forth
across the cosmos in real time!   This allows tele-robotics and
telepresence to operate instantly across the cosmos with technology
only marginally in advance of our own.

That is, a small portion of a powerful radio pulse sent from Earth
should be capable of being detected back on Earth at the same time, as
well as shortly before and shortly after it was sent, since a portion
of the energy travels through many paths around the black hole.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fytriKJ8xhE

http://www.geocities.com/theophysics/tipler-rotating-cylinders.pdf

Using 1 micron wavelengths, and using emitters locate 1,000 AU
distance from the center of the sun, to use gravity lensing to create
an effective collimated emitter 20 million km in diameter to
illuminate the 20 million km diameter black hole 284 quadrillion km
away.

http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/Hbase/phyopt/Raylei.html

sin theta_r = 1.22 lambda/diam2

lambda = 1e-6 m
diam1 = 2e+10 m

sin theta_r = 6.1e-15

diam2 = L * sin theta_r

L = 2.84e+20 m

diam2 = 2.84e+20 * 6.1e-15
         = 46,557 meters

So, using a system described here, its possible to transmit a signal
to a particular spot on the surface of the supermassive black hole at
the center of the galaxy, and receive a signal back from a similarly
sized spot.

In this way a 'negative delay loop' can be introduced into ANY
telecommunications link, providing instantaneous communications across
ANY distance.
Martha Adams - 26 Aug 2008 04:33 GMT
> The 4 million solar mass - supermassive black hole at the center of
> our galaxy, spins at 37% the speed of light, and is 30,000 light years
[quoted text clipped - 49 lines]
> telecommunications link, providing instantaneous communications across
> ANY distance.

The topic behind *this* topic is the one that
interests me.  It is, this is a great idea but in
my view, the place to explore space from, is
*space*.  First, get those settlements out there,
a working human commercial structure and ecology.

*Then* from a far better place than down here in
the bottom of Terra's gravity well, start exploring
space.  Exploring conceptually; thru instruments;
and directly thru exploring humans (who are out
there looking for among other things, new sites
for settlements).

And from that environment, topics such as Mookie's
fast communication scheme, become no longer abstract
but immediate, relevant, and practical; maybe even
necessary.

So while I like this idea lots, I feel there's a
thing we have to do *first*.  Namely, those human
settlements off-Terra.

Titeotwawki -- mha  [sci.space.policy 2008 Aug 25]
Willie.Mookie@gmail.com - 26 Aug 2008 04:49 GMT
A time-telephone is instrumental in creating a Dirac like impulse
function in human capacity around 2040 known as the technological
singularity - where an infinite amount of progress is compressed into
a finite time.

That is, information from all forward times becomes available at some
finite point in time, and is usefully organized in a computer data
bank.  Such telephones are possible theoretically.  How to reduce them
to practice?

haha.. I think I have the answer.   At least for us.

We'll figure out the details by putting a few good grad students on it
for a few months, and maybe scare up a few telescopes to do the
experiment.  It will put FFT analyzers to good use, and should be
capable of being completed in a matter of minutes - and may even
provide an answer to SETI.   There's no encyclopedia galactica
spanning the galaxy because all the wise guys know you communicate
through the black hole at the center - something like that.  And when
we set up our own time telephone, maybe we'll get someone to break in,
or tap us on the shoulder so to speak!  lol.   Even if they're in the
distant future or past.

A positive result with a simple CTL loop would likely produce a
dedicated time signalling facility, of ever increasing bandwidth.   It
would be great to have a time telephone.  I wouldn't have to wait 10
weeks after I order furniture to have it arrive.  In fact, the
furniture could be on its way as I leave for the store and be setup by
the time I return haha..

I just sent an e-mail to time researcher, Ron Mallett, and one of his
RAs at the University of Connecticut - based on my comments here on
usenet.

I will report any progress in the future!  lol.

Here's what it says in part;

Ron, Marshall,

I was looking at the possibility of having sun orbiting power
satellites to beam energy to laser light sail driven starships by way
of gravity lensing around the sun from a great distance away.  I was
wondering how far one might project useful energy.

Then I was wondering about the sensitivity of a telescope that used
the sun's gravity field as a lens.

Then I started thinking about the 4 million solar mass - supermassive
black hole at the center of our galaxy.

The object spins once every 11 minutres.  That means the 23 million km
diameter sphere spins with an equatorial speed at 37% the speed of
light.  It is also approximately  30,000 light years away.

As Ron knows, it is possible to send signals around that object in a
way that returns a portion of the signal back to Earth at a points in
time earlier as well as later than it left.  That is some of the
radiant energy arriving at the black hole forms a CTL path
implementing a reversed time link with nothing more than a radio
telescope.

With such a setup it should be possible to send signals back and forth
across the cosmos in real time!   This allows tele-robotics and
telepresence to operate instantly across the cosmos with technology
only marginally in advance of our own.   Real time data links with
Mars for example and obviously - beyond.

That is, a small portion of a powerful radio pulse sent from Earth
should be capable of being detected back on Earth at the same time, as
well as shortly before and shortly after it was sent, since a portion
of the energy travels through many paths around the black hole.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fytriKJ8xhE

http://www.geocities.com/theophysics/tipler-rotating-cylinders.pdf

Using 1 micron wavelengths, and using emitters locate 1,000 AU
distance from the center of the sun, to use gravity lensing to create
an effective collimated emitter 20 million km in diameter to
illuminate the 20 million km diameter black hole 284 quadrillion km
away.

http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/Hbase/phyopt/Raylei.html

sin theta_r = 1.22 lambda/diam1

lambda = 1e-6 m
diam1 = 2e+10 m

sin theta_r = 6.1e-15

diam2 = L * sin theta_r

L = 2.84e+20 m

diam2 = 2.84e+20 * 6.1e-15
         = 46,557 meters

So, using a system described here, its possible to transmit a signal
to a particular spot only 46.6 km in diameter on the surface of the
supermassive black hole at the center of the galaxy, and receive a
signal back from a similarly sized spot.

Knowing the physical characteristics of this object it should be
possible to send signals through CTL pathways efficiently, and
receieve an instantaneous confirmation of that fact!

In this way a 'negative delay loop' can be introduced into ANY
telecommunications link, providing instantaneous communications across
ANY distance over the time frame the supermassive black hole
exists.

It is also possible to signal from any point in time to any other in
this interval!

Can we do this with conventional radio telescopes?

The 1,000 ft (304.8 m) Arecibo dish operating in the water hole - 21
cm - wavelength - can project a spot at 30,000 light years of;

http://www.setileague.org/general/waterhol.htm

diam2 = L * 1.22 lambda/diam1

lambda = 0.21 m
diam1 = 304.8m
L = 2.84e+20 m = 30,000 ly

diam2 = 25.21 light years

ONLY A VERY SMALL PORTION OF THE ENERGY FALLS ON THE 23 MILLION KM
DIAMETER BLACK HOLE.

Using a VLBI setup with a 10,000 km separation

lambda = 0.21 m
diam1 = 1e+7 m
L = 2.84e+20 m = 30,000 ly
    7.2 million km

ALL THE ENERGY FALLS ON A SPECIFIC SPOT ON THE 23 MILLION KM DIAMETER
BLACK HOLE - WHICH MEANS CONVENTIONAL VLBI TECHINQUES USING 21 CM
WAVELENGTHS SHOULD BE CAPABLE OF CREATING AND DETECTING CTL LIGHT
PATHS AROUND THE GALAXY'S CORE!

This provides not only important scientific information, but will also
provide profound technological capabilities.

William Mook,
Willie.Mookie@gmail.com - 26 Aug 2008 14:56 GMT
Light contains energy.  The speed of light is slowed in a gravity
field due to massenergy.  Light or radio waves, therefore when added
to the environment of the ergosphere, should be able to produce
nonlinear optical effects.

http://www.sciam.com/article.cfm?id=information-in-the-hologr-2003-08

http://www.sciamdigital.com/index.cfm?fa=Products.ViewIssuePreview&ARTICLEID_CHA
R=0E90201A-2B35-221B-6BBEB44296C90AAD


http://www.uctv.tv/search-details.asp?showID=11140

In short, the physics of light transport through the ergosphere can be
recast in the mathematics of nonlinear optics.  That is, in the
ergosphere of a spinning black hole, radio or light energy should be
capable of generating a conjugate beam to itself - extracting
significant energy from the ergosphere itself - making a signal that
is easily detectable.

http://www.ias.ac.in/jarch/jaa/6/85-100.pdf

The ergosphere around the equator of the spinning black hole is
therefore illuminated in such a way that the signal is preferentially
emitted conjugate to the incoming beam.  The physics of the Penrose
Process allow the emitted conjugate signal to possess far more power
than the arriving signal.

The next challenge is the arrival time of the emitted signal.  We want
in our first experiment, to cause the emitted signal to arrive at the
point of origin (Earth/Sol) precisely when the illuminating signal is
sent.  This means causing the signal to be emitted 30,000 years before
it arrives making for a quick experimental confirmation at Earth/Sol..

Now the math says it might be possible to do this.  To send a beam to
a black hole that causes it to echo a more powerful pulse directly at
Earth/Sol and do so in such a way as to have it arrive at the time the
pulse was crated.

To understand how this is possible, consider that light can orbit a
stationary black hole for long periods of time.   At a radius where
the escape velocity is 70.7% the speed of light - orbital velocity is
equal to the speed of light.  So radio waves or light waves that
arrive tangent to the surface at that radius - will continue in orbit
around the black hole a long long time.

This is an important feature, so lets look at it in more detail.

Imagine you are being lowered into this supermassive blackhole,
standing so your feet are pointed toward the center, and your head
toward the starrs lowering yourself to the center feet first.. You
have a laser pointer and you're pointing it horizontally as you
descend.

As you get closer to the event horizon the laser beam gets bent more
and more around the horizon of the black hole.  Now, as you fall, the
escape velocity at that radius rises, and so too the orbital
velocity.  When you are at a radius where the escape velocity is 70.7%
of the speed of light, the orbital velocity is the speed of light.  A
laser beam directed toward the horizontal at this radius, will
circulate around the black hole, forever - in a classical stationary
sense.

Now consider that a spinning black hole drags spacetime around with
it, and creates an ergosphere - which can be manipulated by
structuring the incoming signal so as to create a pulse at some later
or earlier time using the energy of the ergosphere itself.

In this way, an experiment can be done, and pehaps a new technical
capacity can be developed to send signals through time.
Willie.Mookie@gmail.com - 27 Aug 2008 00:14 GMT
Because the ergosphere around a spinning black hole involves turning
spacetime itself into a nonlinear optical media the conjugate wave
solutions that are possible in mundane nonlinear media actually have
reversed time terms in them in dealing with ergospheres around
spinning black holes.  This allows conjugate beams to arrive at the
same or nearly the same time the original beam is formed.  Not only
that,but the ability to tap the energy of a spiinning black hole by
dropping particles into the ergosphere - including microwave photons -
permits echoes to be far more powerful than the original pulse.

Thus a black hole appears capable of returning pulses powerful enough
and timely enough to do experiments real-time with today's radio
telescopes.

That is, it appears possible to contemplate experiments done with
radio telescope arrays today that actually provide important
experimental feedback on quantum gravity.

Furthermore, a successful research program, may have important
technical consequences, such as delay free instantaneous
communications over large distances, as well as the ability to signal
through time and across dimensions of time, opening up new avenues of
exploration and discovery..

Objects can orbit a non-spinning black hole near the speed of light.
The orbits are non keplerian, non newtonian - and use the einstein
theory of general relativity to predict movements.

http://www.fourmilab.ch/gravitation/orbits/

The point of this description in the present context is to point out
that a light beam can be made to circulate near the event horizon and
then come out again.  Since the transit time is about 4 minutes for
the black hole at the center of our galaxy, it takes about 4 billion
orbits to equal 30,000 years - the distance the black hole is from
Earth.

To get a delay like this, all one has to do is illuminate the precise
region at the appropriate position tangent to the event horiizon at
the appropriate altitude above the event horizon.

Of course we want the conjugate beam to emerge 30,000 years before it
arrives, so that when it arrives back at Earth, the experimenters are
still at the radio telescope listening for the pulse.

To do this bit of magic requires that the black hole be spinning.
This creates what is known as an ergosphere above the equator of the
black hole's event horizon.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ergosphere
http://demonstrations.wolfram.com/OrbitsAroundASpinningBlackHole/

Here spacetime itself has the potential to become a nonlinear optical
medium.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nonlinear_optical_medium

These media change the speed of light in the medium as the intensity
of light changes.

In an ergosphere, the speed of light does not change, but the speed of
light realtive to the external universe changes - and that variation
itself changes with the energy contained in the light itself- allowing
the formulation of light transport in the ergosphere to be recast in
nonlinear optics terms.

When one does this it is quite easy to see that illumination of a
particular region of space around the event horizon of a black hole,
with appropriately configured signals, results in amplified signals
being detected at the point of origin at times before or
simultaneously with the emissoin of the illuminating pulse at the
point of origin.

.
 
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