A Brief History of the Flat Universe
|
|
Thread rating:  |
Eric Flesch - 22 Nov 2007 11:03 GMT Well, there's the official history of the flat universe, and, dare I say it, the real history, which has an important social component. Dates are approximate.
The Official History (very brief): After the FRW model gained widepread acceptance in the 1960's, the universe was considered to be at "critical density", such that expansion was in-between a perpetual-expansion state, and reversion to contraction. This provided for a flat manifold. In 1998, BoomeranG observations showed the CMB to be displaying a flat manifold. WMAP has since improved these observations. (end of the official history)
The REAL History: With acceptance of the FRW model in the 1960's, came the concept that the geometry of the universe depended on whether it was permanently expanding (hyperbolic manifold), at critical density (flat), or eventually reverting to contraction (spherical). There were, however, problems with the FRW model, notably the horizon problem (how such uniformity is possible), and the size problem (how the universe attained its large size). In 1977 Alan Guth made a breakthrough with his revolutionary (I would say "magic wand") theory of inflation. The engine of inflation is such that it is both constrained by, and producing of, a flat space-time. This is to say, inflation and the flat universe are ONE AND THE SAME, operationally.
Armed with Guth's inflation, many problems were resolved, but at the (gladly paid) price of an enforced flat universe. The "critical density" universe was now gospel in that it was a requirement of inflation. This went on into the 1990's, even as observational problems began to multiply. In the 1990's, supernova observations became seriously discrepant with the critical density universe. However, the critical density universe could not be discarded without discarding inflation as well. Remember that it was still the paradigm that a perpetually-expanding universe would be a hyperbolic continuum. Since inflation was an absolute requirement for the FRW model to work, the critical density universe had to be adhered to. This went on for a few uncomfortable years in the mid 1990's.
Enter the BoomeranG observations! Carried by high-atmosphere balloons, detailed observations were made of the CMB. The black body contours were revealed. These were interpreted as observational evidence for a flat universe.
(Here's the important part) Suddenly, the pressure was off! No longer was the critical density universe the only observational confirmation of the flat universe. Now there was new confirmation. And almost immediately, the supernova data was published and the critical density universe was refuted. A new paradigm of perpetual expansion was promulgated, but without the previous requirement that this would entail a hyperbolic universe. No, with the BoomeranG observations "confirming" the flat universe, the gap between old paradigm and new paradigm was filled with DARK MATTER and DARK ENERGY. In this way, the flat universe is retained, and so inflation is retained, and so the FRW model is retained. Thanks, BoomeranG! And thanks, WMAP!
But, this is the message of the synchronicity of the supernova publications, and BoomeranG. The first would not have been possible without the second. The flat universe had to be retained at all costs!
So you see, this is what I have meant about the circular "evidence" for a flat universe which is holding up the FRW cosmology. IN FACT, the concept came first (with "inflation"), and the evolution of the model is allowed only under the mandatory constraint that the flat universe be retained. It has gone so far, that it has now become acceptable to model the universe as consisting MOSTLY of invisible matter and unknowable energy. Crazy!!
People, the hyperbolic universe is out there, waiting to be found. How can we slip out of the straight-jacket of inflation and the flat universe?
Eric Flesch
Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply - 23 Nov 2007 10:28 GMT In article <mt2.0-24888-1195729429@hercules.herts.ac.uk>, eric@flesch.org (Eric Flesch) writes:
> Well, there's the official history of the flat universe, and, dare I > say it, the real history, which has an important social component. [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > widepread acceptance in the 1960's, the universe was considered to be > at "critical density", This is not really true. Einstein and de Sitter suggested one of the flat models almost 80 years ago, but primarily because it was mathematically simple and, at the time, couldn't be ruled out observationally. Later on, in the 1960s and 1970s, observational evidence was for a low-density universe, implying your favourite hyperbolic geometry if one assumes no cosmological constant (and there was no evidence for the cosmological constant then).
> such that expansion was in-between a > perpetual-expansion state, and reversion to contraction. This > provided for a flat manifold. In 1998, BoomeranG observations showed > the CMB to be displaying a flat manifold. WMAP has since improved > these observations. (end of the official history) OK.
> The REAL History: With acceptance of the FRW model in the 1960's, > came the concept that the geometry of the universe depended on whether > it was permanently expanding (hyperbolic manifold), at critical > density (flat), or eventually reverting to contraction (spherical). Assuming no cosmological constant.
> There were, however, problems with the FRW model, notably the horizon > problem (how such uniformity is possible), and the size problem (how > the universe attained its large size). There is not a consensus as to whether these are really problems.
> In 1977 Alan Guth made a > breakthrough with his revolutionary (I would say "magic wand") theory > of inflation. The engine of inflation is such that it is both > constrained by, and producing of, a flat space-time. This is to say, > inflation and the flat universe are ONE AND THE SAME, operationally. Generically, inflation makes the universe so large that the local curvature is very close to flat, in the sense that the Earth is flat locally. It says nothing about the global geometry (except that the latter is now difficult to measure).
> Armed with Guth's inflation, many problems were resolved, but at the > (gladly paid) price of an enforced flat universe. The "critical > density" universe was now gospel in that it was a requirement of > inflation. This went on into the 1990's, even as observational > problems began to multiply. This is true, and is a case of a few people in influential positions with axes to gring perpetuating a view long after it was no longer tenable. But, hey, science once again showed that self-correction works and the truth won out.
> In the 1990's, supernova observations > became seriously discrepant with the critical density universe. It depends on what you mean by "critical density". The important thing is that they implied accelerated expansion.
> However, the critical density universe could not be discarded without > discarding inflation as well. It was the combination of the supernovae measurements and "direct" measurements of the density which led to a low-density flat universe as the now currently popular "standard model".
> Remember that it was still the paradigm > that a perpetually-expanding universe would be a hyperbolic continuum. Only if one assumes no cosmological constant, but that assumption is not compatible with observations and assuming inflation or a flat universe has nothing to do with it.
> Since inflation was an absolute requirement for the FRW model to work, No. Perhaps to solve the problems you mentioned, if indeed they need to be solved.
> Enter the BoomeranG observations! Carried by high-atmosphere > balloons, detailed observations were made of the CMB. The black body > contours were revealed. These were interpreted as observational > evidence for a flat universe. OK.
> (Here's the important part) Suddenly, the pressure was off! No > longer was the critical density universe the only observational > confirmation of the flat universe. Now there was new confirmation. > And almost immediately, the supernova data was published and the > critical density universe was refuted. Actually, the CMB experiments and the supernovae stuff (each consists of several papers) were published during the same time frame.
> A new paradigm of perpetual > expansion was promulgated, but without the previous requirement that > this would entail a hyperbolic universe. No, with the BoomeranG > observations "confirming" the flat universe, the gap between old > paradigm and new paradigm was filled with DARK MATTER and DARK ENERGY. Actually, dark matter has nothing to do with it. The value of Omega of about 0.3 is consistent with "non-cosmological" observations. Dark energy is just a fancy name for the cosmological constant. It is observed. It doesn't fill a gap. That would be the case of one assumes flatness, knows Omega, and postulates dark energy to make up the difference. But the effects of dark energy, namely accelerated expansion, are observed.
> In this way, the flat universe is retained, and so inflation is > retained, and so the FRW model is retained. Thanks, BoomeranG! And > thanks, WMAP! Again, all of this observational evidence is independent of whether or not there was inflation.
> But, this is the message of the synchronicity of the supernova > publications, and BoomeranG. The first would not have been possible > without the second. The flat universe had to be retained at all costs! This is simply wrong.
> People, the hyperbolic universe is out there, waiting to be found. > How can we slip out of the straight-jacket of inflation and the flat > universe? Your evidence, please?
Eric Flesch - 24 Nov 2007 10:45 GMT On Fri, 23 Nov 07, Phillip Helbig wrote:
>eric@flesch.org (Eric Flesch) writes: >> The REAL History: With acceptance of the FRW model in the 1960's, [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > >Assuming no cosmological constant. That's right, I had forgotten! It was eventually set to zero. They certainly called it zero in my undergraduate days (70s, 80s)
>Generically, inflation makes the universe so large that the local >curvature is very close to flat, in the sense that the Earth is flat >locally. It says nothing about the global geometry (except that the >latter is now difficult to measure). Well, if today's universe is truly flat, as WMAP is claimed to show, it's a fair extension to say that the mechanism which produced the universe, i.e., inflation, produced the flatness causally. Surely you agree.
>> Since inflation was an absolute requirement for the FRW model to work, > >No. Perhaps to solve the problems you mentioned, if indeed they need to >be solved. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cosmic_inflation has a good round-up of all of this, including the problems. I think most cosmologists agree that these are genuine problems which are addressed by inflation.
>> And almost immediately, the supernova data was published and the >> critical density universe was refuted. > >Actually, the CMB experiments and the supernovae stuff (each consists of >several papers) were published during the same time frame. Yep, the scientific community knew what was going on, during the publication process.
>But the effects of dark energy, namely accelerated >expansion, are observed. Insofar that the term "dark energy", is just a placeholder for the actual cause, sure. (The actual cause being, in my view, geometry)
>> But, this is the message of the synchronicity of the supernova >> publications, and BoomeranG. The first would not have been possible >> without the second. The flat universe had to be retained at all costs! > >This is simply wrong. I have here presented that the history of the published literature shows that this was the motivation. I think any archivist would agree that my interpretation is a fair call.
>> People, the hyperbolic universe is out there, waiting to be found. >> How can we slip out of the straight-jacket of inflation and the flat >> universe? > >Your evidence, please? addressed in another posting.
Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply - 26 Nov 2007 10:26 GMT In article <mt2.0-23303-1195901113@hercules.herts.ac.uk>, eric@flesch.org (Eric Flesch) writes:
> On Fri, 23 Nov 07, Phillip Helbig wrote: > >eric@flesch.org (Eric Flesch) writes: [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > That's right, I had forgotten! It was eventually set to zero. They > certainly called it zero in my undergraduate days (70s, 80s) Indeed. The cosmological constant is an idea whose time has come, and gone, and come, and gone. In the 1970s and 1980s, classical cosmology had gone about as far as it could with the methods of the day and there was no evidence for a cosmological constant, so many folks set it to zero just to make calculations simpler.
> >Generically, inflation makes the universe so large that the local > >curvature is very close to flat, in the sense that the Earth is flat > >locally. It says nothing about the global geometry (except that the > >latter is now difficult to measure). > > Well, if today's universe is truly flat, as WMAP is claimed to show, No-one claims that WMAP demonstrates that the universe is "truly flat", but rather that Omega + lambda is rather close to 1. Observationally, one would require an infinitely small error to measure it as "truly flat". And if exact flatness is included within the error bars, so are both positive and negative curvature (though with a rather large radius of curvature).
> it's a fair extension to say that the mechanism which produced the > universe, i.e., inflation, produced the flatness causally. Surely you > agree. Generically, inflation implies (near) flatness. But flatness does not, in itself, imply inflation.
> >> Since inflation was an absolute requirement for the FRW model to work, > > [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > all of this, including the problems. I think most cosmologists agree > that these are genuine problems which are addressed by inflation. That's probably true. But, to be fair, most cosmologists don't work directly with these problems and probably quote what (they think) is the majority opinion when asked. There are certainly many big-name cosmologists who doubt the extent to which the problems which inflation can solve even exist (i.e. they debate the fact that they are problems; they don't debate the observational facts). John Barrow, George Ellis and Peter Coles, to name a few. Even if it is a minority opinion, it is a) the opinion of those who have actually studied the problems for years and b) as long as this is a real debate one can't say that inflation is an absolute requirement for the FRW model to work.
> >> And almost immediately, the supernova data was published and the > >> critical density universe was refuted. [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > Yep, the scientific community knew what was going on, during the > publication process. Actually, the first paper by the Supernova Cosmology Project reported evidence (though with large error bars) FOR the Einstein-de Sitter universe. It later turned out that this was due to the effects of one unusually bright object in their sample. It was only later that the evidence started to accumulate for the flat lambda model. Two independent teams came to this conclusion, and in neither case was it what they a priori wanted to believe.
> >But the effects of dark energy, namely accelerated > >expansion, are observed. > > Insofar that the term "dark energy", is just a placeholder for the > actual cause, sure. (The actual cause being, in my view, geometry) Again, the two effects are not degenerate and can and are distinguished observationally.
> >> But, this is the message of the synchronicity of the supernova > >> publications, and BoomeranG. The first would not have been possible [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > shows that this was the motivation. I think any archivist would agree > that my interpretation is a fair call. We are talking in both cases about observational programs which lasted several years, started independently and published several papers over a period of years. It seems strange to see a conspiracy here.
Eric Flesch - 27 Nov 2007 08:21 GMT On Mon, 26 Nov 07 10:26:39 GMT, Phillip Helbig wrote:
>eric@flesch.org (Eric Flesch) writes: >> Well, if today's universe is truly flat, as WMAP is claimed to show, > >No-one claims that WMAP demonstrates that the universe is "truly flat", >but rather that Omega + lambda is rather close to 1. And why would that be, if not causally? All today's paper are just taking it as 1. So they are using the idea that it is "truly flat" in all their calculations and graphs. How can you say that "no-one claims" it, when everyone does it?
>> it's a fair extension to say that the mechanism which produced the >> universe, i.e., inflation, produced the flatness causally. Surely you >> agree. > >Generically, inflation implies (near) flatness. But flatness does not, >in itself, imply inflation. That's right! But I suspect you are taking an unpublished position of advocacy in this discussion, whilst I am treating the published literature.
>There are certainly many big-name >cosmologists who doubt the extent to which the problems which inflation [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] >and b) as long as this is a real debate one can't say that inflation is >an absolute requirement for the FRW model to work. That is interesting. So when do they publish?
>Actually, the first paper by the Supernova Cosmology Project reported >evidence (though with large error bars) FOR the Einstein-de Sitter [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >independent teams came to this conclusion, and in neither case was it >what they a priori wanted to believe. Whatever the operational reasons, their early results supported the "critical density" universe, and their later results, once BoomeranG was out, refuted it. The results speak for themselves. Their accounting of how they came to those results, are just afterthoughts. So there was one critical data point that made a big difference? "Yeah, right".
>> I have here presented that the history of the published literature >> shows that this was the motivation. I think any archivist would agree [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >several years, started independently and published several papers over a >period of years. It seems strange to see a conspiracy here. Hmm, if you watch a roomful of people late at night, you might notice that some of them begin to yawn. Soon the yawns spread. It is a conspiracy of communication, telling people that it is bedtime. But it's not strange. Similarly, to see bands of astronomers following research precedents and social dictates may seem conspiratorial in a operational sense, but it is no more strange than a yawn.
Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply - 28 Nov 2007 09:11 GMT In article <mt2.0-25855-1196151684@hercules.herts.ac.uk>, eric@flesch.org (Eric Flesch) writes:
> On Mon, 26 Nov 07 10:26:39 GMT, Phillip Helbig wrote: > >eric@flesch.org (Eric Flesch) writes: [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > And why would that be, if not causally? Why not? They are free parameters. If you know what caused them to have the values they do, then please let us know. These are MEASURED values. We shouldn't let our expectations influence what we measure.
> All today's paper are just > taking it as 1. In what context? In many cases, for the accuracy needed, 1 is good enough. If I want to calculate how much fuel my car needs to drive to Stockholm, I don't need to know the distance to the millimeter, or even to the kilometer, precisely.
> So they are using the idea that it is "truly flat" in > all their calculations and graphs. How can you say that "no-one > claims" it, when everyone does it? The error is quite small. For the purposes of the calculations, it doesn't matter. But for, for example, those who wish space to be hyperbolic, a negative curvature is still possible. However, due to the large radius of curvature, direct effects of this curvature are difficult to observe.
> That's right! But I suspect you are taking an unpublished position of > advocacy in this discussion, whilst I am treating the published > literature. One doesn't need to know anything about inflation in order to determine the cosmological parameters from observation. Whether or not someone mentions that the values are in accordance with expectations from inflation doesn't matter. (And, again, even inflation doesn't say "exactly flat", but rather a huge radius of curvature.)
> That is interesting. So when do they publish? They have. Read the literature. Coles and Ellis wrote an entire book on why they believe the universe is not the Einstein-de Sitter model. They spend an entire chapter discussing the flatness problem.
> Whatever the operational reasons, their early results supported the > "critical density" universe, True.
> and their later results, once BoomeranG > was out, refuted it. In urban areas, compared to the countryside, a) there are fewer storks and b) the birth rate is lower. Don't confuse correlation (in this case, temporal correlation) with causation.
> The results speak for themselves. Their > accounting of how they came to those results, are just afterthoughts. This is simply rubbish and an unnecessary criticism of the people involved. Hey, get their original data, reduce them yourself, do the analysis, and you'll get the same result if you don't make any mistakes. If you can find where they fudged, let us know!
And yes, there was another group which INDEPENDENTLY got the same results.
Eric Flesch - 28 Nov 2007 17:19 GMT On Wed, 28 Nov 07 09:11:23 GMT, Phillip Helbig wrote:
>eric@flesch.org (Eric Flesch) writes: >> The results speak for themselves. Their >> accounting of how they came to those results, are just afterthoughts. > >This is simply rubbish and an unnecessary criticism of the people >involved. Hey, get their original data, reduce them yourself, <etc> http://www.sheldrake.org/Onlineexp/offline/constants/index.html Data creep of fundamental constants. e.g. Millikan's oil drop experiment, as explained by Richard Feynman:
"It's interesting to look at the history of measurements of the charge on the electron after Millikan. If you plot them as function of time, you find that one is a little bigger than Millikan's, the next one's a little bigger than that, and the next one's a little bit bigger than that, until finally they settle down to a number that is higher. Why didn't they discover that the new number was higher right away? It's a thing that scientists are ashamed of--this history--because it's apparent that people did things like this: When they got a number that was too high above Millikan's, they would look for and find a number closer to Millikan's value when they didn't look so far. And so they eliminated the numbers that were too far off, and did other things like that."
But I guess you would call Feynman's text, "simply rubbish"?.
How about the speed of light? From the web page: "In 1929, Birge published his review of all the evidence available up to 1927 and came to the conclusion that the best value for velocity of light was 299,796 ± 4 km/s. ...
"From around 1928 to 1945, the velocity of light appeared to be about 20 km/s lower than before and after this period. The 'best' values, found by the leading investigators using a variety of techniques, were in impressively close agreement with each other, and the available data were combined and adjusted by Birge in 1941 and Dorsey in 1945. In the late 1940s the speed of light went up again. ...
"How can the lower velocity from 1928 to 1945 be explained? If it was simply a matter of experimental error, why did the results of different investigators and different methods agree so well? And why were the estimated errors so low?"
I suppose, Phil, that your explanation would be that the speed of light actually was 20 km/s lower from 1928 to 1945, right?
[Mod. note: speculation about other posters' interpretation of facts is discouraged -- mjh]
Eric
Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply - 29 Nov 2007 08:51 GMT In article <mt2.0-18231-1196270384@hercules.herts.ac.uk>, eric@flesch.org (Eric Flesch) writes:
> On Wed, 28 Nov 07 09:11:23 GMT, Phillip Helbig wrote: > >eric@flesch.org (Eric Flesch) writes: [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > Data creep of fundamental constants. e.g. Millikan's oil drop > experiment, as explained by Richard Feynman: Yes, this has happened. Einstein himself was guilty of it once. However, just because someone made some mistake in the past is no reason to suspect that this applies to all measurements, or to specific measurements, unless you have additional evidence---which you don't.
|
|
|